Wednesday, December 1, 2010

The State Of Our Education

Classroom Beating: Florida Student Gets Pummeled While Teacher Sits Back

This teacher sat back and did not try to break up the fight because he was not "properly trained" to break up a fight.


When I was in school this did not stop the teachers. They would grab you and drag you to the office.


Always On Watch said...


I will say in defense of the teacher that teachers are constantly warned "Never touch a student if you want to avoid a law suit."

Always On Watch said...

A bit of clarification: If a teacher touches a student against school policy, any liability insurance held by the school for the teacher is void. This idiocy has been in place since 1977, as I know from personal experience in the public school system.

Always On Watch said...

And...The students know about this liability thing too. I once had a student dare me to touch him. "Touch me and I'll sue your ass off." 1975.

Randy said...

I agree with AOW. My wife is a special needs teacher. She received special training so that she certified to give a student a bear hug to keep them from hurting others or themselves (she had to do this with one of her severely handicapped students once). She's not certified to break up fights. Given some of the kids, I don't want her breaking up fights.

I had a shop teacher in the 7th grade who had a neat way of handling fights. He would clear all the chairs away and get everyone to stand around the two fighting. As they danced around waiting on each other to make a move, he would push one of them towards the other and they would immediately back away. He would tell everyone that "one of them is scared and the other is glad."

After a few minutes of them walking in circles, he would send them both to the office. Looking back, it took a lot of discernment on his part to know when to do this and when not.

He retired in about 1974. It's a shame...

Chuck said...

AOW, I understand but this is all just a symptom of the problem. Also, I am not saying the teacher should man-handle the kids. They should though keep a kid from getting beat up. I'm a little skeptical that a lawsuit against a teacher in this situation would get very far.

Randy, a couple of things. One, my biggest beef is that the teacher in the article was not properly trained. Why not? Why would he be in a classroom if he was not properly trained? Second, I am not suggesting a teacher get themselves hurt. We have to deal with unruly people in the ER and things get quite physical. I have done a lot of wrestling in my day. My number one rule though is everyone must be safe, especially my staff. We are trained to do this in a manner that protects the safety of both the patient and the staff.

Schools need to provide safety for the children there. If the teachers cannot do it they either need to provide someone else that can or put the kids that are causing trouble out on the street. If a teacher stands by and lets one of my kids get pummeled and does nothing, they are going to have their own fight on their hands.

cube said...

From this and many other horror stories, it is clear that the policies in place at schools aren't working.

Sure, it's part of a teacher's job to promote an environment where children can learn, but if your hands are shackled by ridiculous policies, you won't be able to instill the discipline that is required to keep the kids in line.

In this case, the teacher should've intervened during the verbal stage preventing the fight in the first place.

I know that doesn't help the poor boy who was beaten, but I would advise the principal to make sure all the teachers are trained to stop fights, and to make an announcement to students and their parents that any future fights and acts of bullying will be reported to the police.

And enforce the policy.

It will curb some of the violence and the lawsuits.

Brooke said...

I agree with Cube and AOW, but I see your point as well, Chuck.

I would be loath to intervene without calling for reinforcements. You just don't know if one of those little bastards is armed... Where I work now, a much smaller hospital, if someone gets out of line EVERYONE who isn't in a 'stuck' position responds. Typically the show of force backs the fool down. The same strategy could be employed in cases like this. Or a fire hose. ;)

Mustang said...

It is perfectly normal for parents to want their children to be safe when they go to school. That is, among the few parents who give a damn one way or another. What is not perfectly normal is the assumption that teachers are day care attendants. Most people, well educated people, go into teaching to … well, teach. They did not go into teaching so that a gang of thugs could beat the crap out of them in the parking lot while the principle watches and does nothing. They do not want to become teachers so that some shit-for-brains kid can walk into the classroom with a pistol and shoot them dead. They do not become teachers so that they can be assigned menial tasks in the school cafeteria, or stand outside in the miserable cold to ensure that “children” don’t buy and sell drugs to one another. They do not want to become teachers so that parents can sue their asses off at every opportunity, or for principles or other administrators to shift blame on to them for their own failings. No one wants to become a teacher to pay for student’s lost books, and no one wants to become a teacher so that mainstream “special needs” kids doped up on methylphenidate can make a complete disaster out of a 55-minute class period. All in all, I cannot imagine why any informed person would want to become a teacher today. I was one, and I hated every moment of it after my fifth year.

Ticker said...

Back in the day when kids knew there were consequences for such BS behavior it seldom happened. When it did the teacher either verbally or physically broke up the fight. I saw female teachers in their 60's kick punks asses with their "school teacher high heeled shoes" and that ended that. Then it was off the office where the principal would take out his board, about 2 inches wide and three feet long with holes in it, wrapped in tape and meant to inflict pain and your butt would bear the marks for days. If you were not just a "hood" when you got home you got another butt whooping.

In my short tenure of "teaching" I put em on the wall and told them when they felt froggy , jump, and I'll gig you sorry butt. End conversation.

Unfortunately punks can rule the schools and the hallways because they know there are no consequences. It's time to bring consequences back into schools and society in general.

Chuck said...

Cube, good point on stopping the fight before it started.

Brooke, we use show of force very effectively. Someone acts up they quickly have 3 - 4 beefy security officers and 2 - 3 male nurses (and we grow them big in the ER) in the room. We have limited tolerance for nonsense in the ER, things get out of control too quickly.

Mustang, you got further than I did. I spent one semester in a class room (in the inner city) and changed majors. I agree that teachers are not baby-sitters and I want them safe but I think when you take on the responsibility of having children under your care, you have a responsibility to keep them as safe as is possible. I do think we need to be looking at who is in our public schools. If kids cannot behave, put them in a special school, with guards if needed.


Unfortunately punks can rule the schools and the hallways because they know there are no consequences. It's time to bring consequences back into schools and society in general.

I agree completely

cube said...

Ticker: Back in the day, if we acted up in school, we had to deal with the wrath of our parents. Yes, back then most of us had two parents and, at least in my house, I would've had to deal with both of them. Ouch!

I'm not advocating beatings by any means, but the threat of punishment at home kept my butt in line. My parents weren't my friends, they were my parents, and despite it all, I love them dearly to this day.